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Post #1
Do you believe that we posses free will? Is it even possible?
I don't think we do. Biochemistry determines how our brains work, and biochemistry is "ruled" by physics. There is no scientific reason to believe that our brains are capable of actually making something from nothing. The closest we come is quantum physics, and that's completely random.
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That's possibly the first OP that I agree with.
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you're thinking way too far into this
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Didn't have a choice.
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It does exist even. Its like free radical particles.
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well you just demonstrated free will by thinking about free will so yeah you've nullified this thread
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Did you read the OP or are you shitposting on purpose?
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His brain is wired to think about free will. He didnt freely think about it.
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The best example that free will exists is subliminal messaging. If free will didn't exist and we followed things based on biochemestry then subliminal messaging would've worked, but to date it still fails.
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wow
what kind of paranoia fueled bullshit is this
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Can you show me a definitive test that can support free will and deny lack of it?
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Can you show me otherwise?
We're going into Psychology here so get ready for inconclusive data, lots of inferring and exceptions to rules.
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according to the op we're all wired to do this so obviously we're not going to get anywhere and the problem will never be solved
i'm using my free will to leave this thread because it's horrible
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You're saying free will exists, I'm not making the claim.
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I don't think brain chemistry has much to do with free will. It can't always explain or steer the decisions we make. I think our mind and conciousness is above the physical and chemical stuff in our brain.
While I don't think anything that has happened could've happened differently, I think the course of events is only set on the exact moment of the event, not before.
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IT isn't evidence but its an understanding of what Free Will exactly is.
http://171.67.193.20/entries/freewill/
Its hard to test free will, just because we're ordered by scientific laws, that just means certain protein chains occur. Then there are more rules to how those chains interact with one another and pretty soon you can end up with an almost infinite or atleast very high number of different combinations.
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Our brains are composed of molecules and sub atomic particles, that behave in predictable ways. Free will can't exist.
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The only way you can posit the existence of free will in any meaningful way is by saying humans (or at least life) is somehow transcendent of physics which is a very hard position to maintain indeed.
I guess it's possible to argue we have free will in some sense, but then you're just arguing semantics which is boring. I still have the power to decide between A and B, in as much as I am a part of the universe. Even though I necessarily follow one course of action regardless, I still have the power to follow whatever course is humanly possible, in much the same way as, say, a gun can fire rounds even if it never does.
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While we do have free will hard-coded from birth, what you actually do with it is the free will. That is to say, that free-will is not predetermined. Hence why it is Free Will.
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The moment a molecule decays is unpredictable
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Saw the post and thought of Rush.
Anyway...We have the free will to do what we choose. Doesn't matter if this is obeying someone else or ourselves.
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The people on the side of free will make the most ridiculous arguments.
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Thanks Eudoxia, I didn't know subliminal messaging had nothing to do with tricking us into buying certain products
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The subliminal messaging example is the second most derp post in this thread after ThePutty's "durp paranoia". I mean come the fuck on.
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I don't think we do. It would be terrible if we found out for sure, but the truth is shit.
The premise of not having free will, I think, goes something like this.
If we can predict the motions of a single particle, and we extend that to everything, we can theoretically compute what will happen, and what has happened based on some math.
Meaning the reason why we appear to have free will is because of the initial conditions in the Big Bang.
Perhaps the reason why 9/11 happened is because of some particle not being several nanometers to the left. Chaos theory does a good job of explaining what this is.
The whole calculating thing assumes no one is able to see the results, because then you can (presumably) decide to do the exactly opposite, changing the future.
I think I have it down.
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How is derp?
The entire point of subliminal messaging is to implant suggestions into the mind using photo tricks and the like, effectively trying to control free will.
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Yes, but it doesn't work. What makes you think it would work if we didn't have free will, or that it doesn't work because we did?
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This is not a new argument.
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You guys should read Stephen Hawking's "The Grand Design". Here's a part from chapter 2:
If anyone wants to read more of Hawking's explanation on the concept of "scientific determinism" I suggest getting the book, its a great read.
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Study the bible, open your mind to God, and ask for forgiveness - that is the way to free will from temptation and bodily desires.
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Your post adds nothing to the discussion.
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agreed
-GOPisGOODFORME
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Sure it does. Some cultures believe that your physical body hinders you from free will and everlasting happiness, and I think it's an interesting juxtaposition to this forums mostly Western thought.
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This is a discussion based on facts, not beliefs.
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huh
Edited:
UR A RACIST
(User was banned for this post ("This is NOT how you debate" - Craptasket))
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prove to me that its a fact
-GOPisGOODFORME
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If science conclusively found factual evidence of whether free will exists or not we wouldn't be having discussion. Free will is a philosophical concept that has no hard evidence. Secondly, since there has been debate about free will, major philosophers have quoted their beliefs, religious or not, into their best opinions.
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WOAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH thats deep man. i never thought of that. is that like the matrix or inception?
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There is no free will because everyone does the same thing eventually.
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It's easy to grasp the fact that free will doesn't really exist but thinking about this type of shit can fuck you up
