You know what, my family just bought our second Chinese AK last weekend, and it is fun as hell to shoot. We did not buy it for the purpose of home defense, we bought it for the fact that it was a good price, and our first one was already a lot of fun. Same with our Mosins, etc. The guns we keep for defense are locked up and hidden away, and kept unloaded in most situations. We live in a small town in the Northeast US, but as my father is an ex-cop, he likes to keep guns around, and wants to make sure all of us know gun etiquette. Myself, I'm not big into guns, I don't want 17 of them in my apartment or home. However, what I do want is a reliable handgun that I know how to use, and is fun to shoot. Something that is good for target as well as defense, and if the situation arises, I can rely on to function properly.
I'm not like my family. I'm not super wary of the government, I don't stock tons of food in the basement because I'm afraid of some sort of manmade disaster, however I would like to keep a gun in my home. Simply for the same reason I carry a window breaker/seatbelt cutter. I don't ever want to be in the situation where I am forced to use it, but I would like to have it nonetheless.
Stop fucking sitting around, e-mailing or petitioning a corrupt asshole of a senator/congressman won't do fuck all to stop them voting for a piece of oppressive shit that defies your constitution, or the First Amendment, they need to be reminded of why the Second one exists, and that they're not there to be bought out by greedy asshole corporations, they're there to be YOUR voice.
Stop talking about why the Second Amendment exists if you're not going to use it, and right now is the fucking time to use it, if not to eliminate congress and senate then to scare them, and remind them you're watching, and if they get out of line, they're done.
Shit is fucked up in this country, but its not bad enough that we need to start riding up to the capitol building and start killing people. Its not that bad, yet.
"WELL THOSE AMERICANS HAVE GUNS FOR A REASON, THEY SHOULD GO FUCK SHIT UP"
But in reality it isn't that fucking easy. I know this may shock some of you, but you can get in some serious shit for doing that.
We have guns to use them if it is needed, the only time I think its needed is in the event of martial law or total social collapse.
Now, I'm not saying I'm happy with how stuff is going, but it sure as hell doesn't warrant an armed rebellion. Period.
Moreover, you keep arguing about your Second Amendment and what it's there for, I just fucking told you what it's there for, and I can guarantee you without a democrat majority in the House and Senate next election, your country will only descend farther into a police state. The point of the Second is to give you the ability to have an armed rebellion, to keep the government in check and remind them you're the ones in power, not them. It seems now congress and the senate have forgotten that fact, and I doubt anything at this point except scaring the shit out of them will make them remember. If SOPA and the NDAA pass, your country will be no better in terms of freedom than China, one of the most widely known oppressive dictatorships. Land of the free my ass. If you love your Second fucking amendment so Goddamn much why are you so afraid to talk about one of its main purposes? And I'm not the first to talk about this intention of the amendment, Penn and Teller did in a series they did called "Bullshit about Guns."
Your congress and senate need a fucking wakeup call, and 2012's election may be too late. Your democratic system is fundamentally flawed anyways, and goes against what your founding fathers believed in. They made it so any man can run for President, and it turned into the leader of one of two parties can run for president. You need a third, at least, party to even out the mix and bring some sense and third opinion into your congress, else it'll be the same corrupt fucks who keep getting re-elected, and you'll all be too scared to think about what you truly can do about it.
I don't think anyone will disagree that the US is fucked and getting worse, they will, however, disagree about methods of trying to save it. I'm suggesting a strong reminder to congress that if they step out of line, they're done. Show up there with guns, and sit on capitol hill, chanting something like "We're watching." Congress would shit a brick, and that's what they need, something to make them shit a brick, and shock them back into remembering they are supposed to serve the people, not the corporations. By the time it gets bad enough that you'll need to actually take up arms and shoot something, you may not be able to. If you think gun control is bad there now, after this it can only get worse, and guns are the next thing I can see being on the chopping block after they pass SOPA and the NDAA.
I'm not telling you to kill congress, not yet, I'm telling you to scare them. They need a wakeup call, hell, they've needed one since the Patriot Act. Saying shit like this is covered under your first amendment, as Penn and Teller reminded everyone at the end of their program. If the amendment isn't used for what it's designed for, why have it in the first place? Stand up and fucking do something, before it's too late, which it may already be, SPOA gets voted on today.
Or, if you don't want to see if your likely corrupt congressman will do anything, or senator, by contacting them, and you're not willing to stand up and at least protest the slow destruction of your country and its ideals, you could always sit around and, like everyone else, say "It'll never pass," and then when it does continue to do nothing while your freedoms continue to be robbed from you. If you don't stand up now, I have a feeling your "right" to bear arms will be next on the list of things to restrict/eliminate, and by then it may be too late to stand up, as those who so will be locked away forever under the NDAA provisions for even suggesting doing something against the government, an ability supposedly protected by your First Amendment.
In my opinion, the 2nd amendment is a great thing that we should enjoy. You know the old saying, "Outlaw guns and only outlaws will have guns." One of the reasons I like the amendment is imagine if the U.S. got invaded, not only would the attacking force have to deal with the might of the U.S. military, they would also have the problem of every self-proclaimed "patriot" in the nation taking potshots at them whenever given the chance.
Allow me to bring up something known as the Truman Doctrine.
Showing up on Capitol Hill would paint a horribly wrong picture of what a movement is trying to accomplish.Harry S. Truman posted:
Generally, what I want accomplished in this country is:
An end to corporate personhood and a fair election process that replaces FPTP with a better alternative.
Multiple parties of relatively equal power in government
Legislation and encouragement from government to make America manufacture more goods, increase exports, and support a green economy.
And that's all I can recall at the moment.
Showing up with guns and making demands is no different than the actions of any terrorist organizations out there. The fact is, no matter how strongly you feel or support something there will be people who disagree with you. If we did that now, the media would label us criminals and we'd be thrown in jail, with the rest of America glad we're locked away. The proper, no, the only way we can enact real change in this country is to enlighten our fellow Americans and educate them on the horrors our government is subjecting us to and why they should stand with us against it. Only through supporting independents, people with no obligations to party standards or blocs, can we get through this. And then, if they continue to take corporate money and fail to listen to us, then we will still not act rashly. We should instigate what Occupy Wall Street is currently doing, but on a much larger scale.
At that point it would be clear that only by running this country into the ground, can it rise into the heavens.
The general public is without foresight. The only time the masses ever take meaningful (violent) action against their government is long after they have been pushed too far.
He can veto stupid laws.
where is rating?
I mean sorry to be the bearer of bad news, people, but people die. Shocker, isn't it? Saying "You can't do that!" won't change anything. And if you think it will, well, think again. Criminals will still do it and not get caught, while innocent people will trip the wire accidentally and go to jail for things they didn't mean to do.
You know what, gun control is stupid because the criminals that use them are going to get them illegally, probably cheaper too. They won't waste what little money they have on firearms that will be registered and traceable. I think restricting automatic firearms is smart because then you can make those who own them have a license earned after free/cheap classes.
1. Progressive taxation: those with low incomes pay considerably less of their income in taxes.
2. Welfare: nobody should be too poor to buy food and have a home, so subsidising food and rent for people who otherwise couldn't afford it would make the country less poor.
3. Free and universal healthcare: everyone should be able to afford being sick or injured.
These methods reduce the poverty amongst the lower income class, and consequently their incentive to commit crimes, and that's why these methods work, whether you agree with them or not.
I'd go into more detail but I'll address one of your points.
"phone to call the police"
Guess what, the police aren't your personal army that shows up on command. They are rarely there on time when you need them the most. You really want to rely on someone else when it comes to your life?
ergo the vast majority of people, even with a gun, will be just as at risk as people without - more so if they frighted someone willing to use a gun into using one.
It's a little bit hyperbolic for entertainment purposes, but the point remains. As much as I'm in favour of human rights bills, the Constitution was made in a very different society, and should not necessarily be looked to in regards to the solution for modern-day problems.
This is a pretty interesting thread if you keep the national flags in mind and the USA's gun cult that has left a huge mark in the nation's development from its foundation to this very day.
So, thanks for this thread.
If you guys think the police will always be there for you, then its very obvious to me that not a whole lot of you have been involved with the law. I've had dispatchers hang up on me, hell I've had a highway patrolmen tell me that he couldn't do anything to help me when I had my car got ran off the road by a van. With budget cuts left and right some areas are seeing their police force cut in half.
Marik, what exactly is your post supposed to mean? "gun cult", please.
Guns are like nukes, if someone has one, everyone needs one.