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Post #1
Hi,
Whats your opinion on the Conspiracy about 9/11? Some people think it was planned by the government, and wasn't all the work of The terrorists. For example:
(taken from BBC, link below)
The question: Why did the world's most powerful air force fail to intercept any of the four hijacked planes?
Conspiracy theorists say: The then US Vice President Dick Cheney ordered the military to stand down and not to intercept the planes.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-14665953
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9/11_conspiracy_theories
Whats yr opinion? I personally think 9/11 wasn't the US government, but what do you think?
-Frodo
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Well, personally I do not think it was the government. I am pretty sure a government like ours isn't that idiotic to crash a plane into a their own building. With thousands of civilians inside, on the plane, and on the ground. The government had nothing to gain if they did cause 9/11.
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Despite all the 'evidence' I couldn't fathom even George Bush devising the 911 attacks.
It seems far more likely to just be a terrorist attack.
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Are you implying that George W. Bush isn't intelligent enough to plan such a clever ruse? Not quite sure if I'm just looking too far into what you said or not.
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The only thing that really makes me wonder if something funny could have been going on is AE911truth;
It is still unlikely though.
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Like I said, if the government did really do it. Would would they possibly have to gain?
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While I don't believe that the government really did it, the gain is rather obvious. By planning an attack against yourself than a foreign combatant would willingly accept claim for, you justify war. Al Qaeda would gladly take responsibility for an attack against the United States. Why would the government want to justify war? Most likely, oil. People talk about the war on oil a lot, but it's rarely understood. In all likelihood, you don't have American companies like Exxon Mobil going into heated combat zones drilling oil. What you do have is the possibility of a new democratic, American-loving, Western-esque regime. Such a regime would probably be more willing to allow American oil companies to come drill.
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a easily malleable irrationally fearful public who will do any to protect their safety.
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Good point, but that may risk the possibility of widespread panic. Which may in-turn cause rioting and other messes for them to deal with.
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I personally find the 9/11 conspiracy theories to be just downright offensive to me sometimes, but I understand they have the right to say it.
Most of the theories point out how impossible an entire building complex and part of the Pentagon collapsing is, but they underestimate gravity, engineering, and fire's effect on the day of September 11th. Not to mention all of the mis-quotes and mis-information that is used amongst conspiracy theorists.
Edited:
By bombing and killing several of their own employees?
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Yea, I forgot all about this. It goes to show that again, I am a total idiot.
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The US has used (Or what seems like) false flags before, but most if not all of them got discovered eventually.
Imagine being the biggest country in the world, and not a single person that was in on the operation even considered spilling the beans, and go down in history as, "The man who showed America's true colours."
Edited:
This article kinda summarizes what I am trying to say:
http://www.cracked.com/article_15740...nside-job.html
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Personally I think the government is not that competent to where they could have pulled off the biggest conspiracy in history without leaving sufficient evidence to prove it.
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There is no conspiracy.
Failure to act sooner comes from a lack of understanding of "terrorism" and taking it seriously. Terrorism against America was a new deal. Our intelligence agencies were not prepared to deal with it like we do now (hence 9/11 being a pivotal point in history for changing quite literally the world and especially how things work in America). It was something we could have taken far more seriously years prior but that's retrospect. We learn from our mistakes.
9/11 was not done by the government and it's not an inside job. People need to accept how it has happened already and get on with their lives because there is NO evidence to support an inside job and all "reputable" sources regarding that are whack job conspiracy sites that actually purposely construe information to fit their own belief.
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Those sources actually do put forward some good reasons why the government would want to do it, I just fail to see how the US government is or ever was competent enough to pull off such a massive conspiracy in front of everyone's faces.
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I believe this comic sums up what noble is saying
There is no way in HELL that the government could keep a conspiracy of epic proportions intact. It's incomprehensible.
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It was just a reason to attack Middle-East.
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... Which the US benefited from, how? Oil imports to the US from Iraq have remained unchanged since before or after the invasion (in fact all it did was further destabilize the region,) and if we somehow knew about the massive mineral deposits in Afghanistan it's moot, since the Japanese own the rights.
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Yeah that went real well now didn't it.
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The Government would have nothing to gain from 9/11. An excuse/false flag to invade Afghanistan? Well, sure, except for the fact that we already had reason to engage Al Qaeda and its allies.
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Remember Watergate? Nixon was undone by one disgruntled FBI agent who got pissed about not being promoted and went to the press with the corruption he knew of.I believe this comic sums up what noble is saying
There is no way in HELL that the government could keep a conspiracy of epic proportions intact. It's incomprehensible.
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Because the ONLY thing our government could come up with to get us into a war was killing 3,000 civilians. For fuck's sake.
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They just gave everyone a promotion that day, obviously.
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Why would the air force blow up the hijacked planes with people inside?
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If that is true, then why have oil imports from Iraq only decreased since the invasion, and why were the hijackers depicted as Saudis and not Iraqi, and why did we invade Afghanistan first? Please answer these questions, because your story isn't making any sense. Why did a whole new conspiracy with WMDs have to be constructed when the hijackers could have simply been depicted as Iraqi agents?
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Because they were stupid and didn't think it through, i'd say if i thought it was true.
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They were smart enough to plan such an intricate and thorough conspiracy and keep it a secret from everyone for a decade, yet they did it all for no reason whatsoever because they didn't think it through?
Yeahno
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A green light to invade a country that has oil n shit
its a "kill 50 innocent people to save a 100 lifes" type of thing
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I doubt that if it was the government there would be no way to keep it secret
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Thing is; if we were going to invade a country for it's oil, why not Saudi Arabia? They have a lot more oil, coastal shipping, and many of the terrorists were Saudi Arabian.
Besides, if you look at the amount of oil shipping that's been going on following the invasion of Iraq there hasn't actually been any large-scale extraction of oil for American interests, in fact we probably lost more then we gained from invasion.
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Three points I'd like to make that pretty much destroy the conspiracy theories:
1. There was no stand down, in the entire decade before 9/11 one aircraft was forced down and it took more than twice the amount of time the hijacked planes were in the air, there was not any secret standdown, planes were sent up to intercept the second the government became aware of what was going on, they even broke protocol and the sound barrier to try and get there in time, they simply couldn't do it fast enough.
2. That whole "architects and engineers for 9/11 truth" consists of 00.01% of the world's architects and engineers.
3. This is the Bush administration we're talking about. The Bush administration, do you really think they're capable of anything near this?
This is not a question of whether or not the US government had the motive to do something like this, it is a question of whether or not the US government had the capability to do this and not be blamed, and the answer is no. We got outplayed, simple as that.
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Oh christ, not this again.
This is absolutely vital for people to know.
The vast majority of the people who signed as part of this nutcase group are either faking it, have arse-wiping-value degrees, or are in a completely unrelated field, like landscape architect. For those not in the know, that's a fucking GARDENER.
Edited:
Not that i'm taking the conspiracy theorists' side, but invading the very beating heart of Islam wouldn't go too well.
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It's been great for defense contractors and some oil companies.
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If you truly think the government did 9/11, you're an idiot.
(User was banned for this post ("This is not debating." - Megafan))
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A great man once said; If you are a dick, People shall mess with your title
January 2011
3,595 Posts
To lose tons of people and have to pay the families and to have oil exports in the middle east actually lessen?
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Who is having to pay families? Reducing oil exports is bad for the US economy and US consumers, but it seems only to have helped oil companies become more profitable. Mission Accomplished. War is the ultimate government program. The costs are socialized, while the profits are private.
If I'm wrong about the reasons for our wars, I challenge you to come up with a motivation that makes more sense. Do you honestly think the Bush Administration was actually concerned about "weapons of mass destruction?"
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Except 9/11 only gave us a 'green light' to invade Afghanistan, which is devoid of any oil. It does have large amounts of rare minerals but US companies don't have contracts to mine any of it(last time I checked, anyway).
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The government? Contractors?
