1. Post #1441
    I survived the Temple of Doom
    NoShogun's Avatar
    December 2008
    6,101 Posts
    Your opinion is wrong.

    Knock it off with "all opinions are valid" bullshit. They aren't. This isn't fucking kindergarten.
    Hey let's play the Lankist game:

    cite where I said all opinions are valid
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  2. Post #1442
    gay mexican
    Lankist's Avatar
    July 2006
    14,576 Posts
    What if I don't specifically care about women being treated as equals, what if I just want all of mankind to be treated as equals? No deviations what so ever, aside from those treated differently because they need assistance to live normal lives?
    So you endorse homogenization, the complete destruction of cultural diversity, and expect everyone to behave like you.
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  3. Post #1443
    Gold Member
    sp00ks's Avatar
    January 2008
    12,039 Posts
    Sorry sp00ks, but no one is. And the guy with the teachers, who are you to say that's not true?
    I asked for evidence, and he said he knew somebody who thought like that.
    Not good evidence.
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  4. Post #1444
    gay mexican
    Lankist's Avatar
    July 2006
    14,576 Posts
    Hey let's play the Lankist game:

    cite where I said all opinions are valid
    You said "it's an opinion" as though that gives it license.

    News flash: your opinion is wrong.
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  5. Post #1445
    Gold Member
    Patriarch's Avatar
    June 2010
    1,507 Posts
    Oh hey look who's got a persecution complex.

    Please tell me how hard your life is because of this "severe air of guilt."

    I bet it's really hard to get a white man elected to office.
    You're dodging my original point, which was you basically ignoring his opinion because to you, "it's wrong." I'm not going to comment on whether it does or does not, but the fact you basically dismiss his entire argument because you consider it "false" (this is even more amazing considering it's one of those things that is danm near impossible to proove whether it is true or false) is honestly myopic and pathetic.
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  6. Post #1446
    Resplendent Reenactor
    Zillamaster55's Avatar
    June 2010
    17,631 Posts
    Your opinion is wrong.

    Knock it off with "all opinions are valid" bullshit. They aren't. This isn't fucking kindergarten.
    Well fucking fuck bullshit, his fucking bullshit fuck opinions fucking shit bullshit fuck semantics feminism fuck bullshit fuck fuck.

    Translation:

    You get to tote around your opinion like it's something godlike and needs to be respected at all times, why can't he?
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  7. Post #1447
    Gold Member
    GoDong-DK's Avatar
    November 2009
    14,354 Posts
    Who are you to say I don't have an 8ft long dick and I own a unicorn?

    Anecdotal evidence means absolutely nothing. Occam's Razor combined with the convenience of that 'evidence' to his argument dictates either he inferred it wrongly out of a persecution complex or he just made it up.
    Sure it means absolutely nothing, but why should it be dismissed as lies?
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  8. Post #1448
    gay mexican
    Lankist's Avatar
    July 2006
    14,576 Posts
    On reddit's feminist subreddits and r/lgbt (which was taken over by them and transformed into what they call a "safe space" where concern trolling or tone policing = permaban), you often see people throw around phrases like "SAWCSM" - Straight Able-bodied White Cisgender Male, and often use it in a negative context (ie in a thread about someone making homophobic comments, you see comments like "oh lol, sawcsms" and "am I surprised it came from a SAWCSM?"

    This is where most of my exposure to social justice movements comes from. As far as I can tell, the term "SAWCSM" was invented by feminist redditors, and routinely and systematically use it as an insult.
    wow somebody called you a SAWCSM you must know what it's like to be persecuted then.
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  9. Post #1449
    Midget576's Avatar
    February 2011
    203 Posts
    that's not what happened at all
    it was Sharon Osbourne trying to be edgy while all the women on the view looked at her all cross:

    i don't think that's a demonstration of misandry, else George Carlin's jokes about rape would be misogynistic and i don't think George Carlin was even in the slightest a misogynist.

    very different from this because there's no absurd or gross-out comedy element to the female portrayals in videogames.
    -snip- My bad..
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  10. Post #1450
    Hello, my name is Penis. Please refer to me as such. I'm totally cool with it.
    SPESSMEHREN's Avatar
    November 2009
    4,612 Posts
    Hey let's play the Lankist game:

    cite where I said all opinions are valid
    Expressing an opinion members of a marginalized group disagrees with is called concern trolling. It's not valid logic in social justice circles. So you said all opinions are valid when you decided to express yours without being a member of the marginalized group.
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  11. Post #1451
    gay mexican
    Lankist's Avatar
    July 2006
    14,576 Posts
    Sure it means absolutely nothing, but why should it be dismissed?
    Because it means absolutely nothing.

    It adds nothing to the discussion. It is a worthless tangent that detracts from the subject.
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  12. Post #1452
    Gold Member
    sp00ks's Avatar
    January 2008
    12,039 Posts
    What if I don't specifically care about women being treated as equals, what if I just want all of mankind to be treated as equals? No deviations what so ever, aside from those treated differently because they need assistance to live normal lives?

    I don't like to consider myself a feminist, because it's too narrow. My goal is everyone.
    Oh good, white straight males need more help.
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  13. Post #1453
    I survived the Temple of Doom
    NoShogun's Avatar
    December 2008
    6,101 Posts
    Because straight white men are the primary demographic in video games, despite the fact that women are spending more on games than men.


    That's what this fucking thread is about. Men are being overrepresented in the medium, as well as most other media, to the detriment of the societal image and role of women.
    What games are women spending more money on? I really really doubt that women buy more first person shooters and action RPGs and fighting games than men do and those are the games that people complain about when they say that games are made to appeal to men.
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  14. Post #1454
    Gold Member
    GoDong-DK's Avatar
    November 2009
    14,354 Posts
    I asked for evidence, and he said he knew somebody who thought like that.
    Not good evidence.
    Fair enough.
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  15. Post #1455
    Gold Member
    Dennab
    February 2007
    13,126 Posts
    So you endorse homogenization, the complete destruction of cultural diversity, and expect everyone to behave like you.
    Holy hell what, I don't even... what, oh god haha. I have no idea what you're trying to imply or how you jumped to that conclusion.
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  16. Post #1456
    gay mexican
    Lankist's Avatar
    July 2006
    14,576 Posts
    You get to tote around your opinion like it's something godlike and needs to be respected at all times, why can't he?
    Because he is wrong. Because he is telling a marginalized group to shut up because they're offending him. Because he's saying he wants to hold shitty opinions but doesn't think it's right to feel guilty about holding shitty opinions.

    He is saying that his comfort is more important than representation and agency for women.
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  17. Post #1457
    Gold Member
    sp00ks's Avatar
    January 2008
    12,039 Posts
    On reddit's feminist subreddits and r/lgbt (which was taken over by them and transformed into what they call a "safe space" where concern trolling or tone policing = permaban), you often see people throw around phrases like "SAWCSM" - Straight Able-bodied White Cisgender Male, and often use it in a negative context (ie in a thread about someone making homophobic comments, you see comments like "oh lol, sawcsms" and "am I surprised it came from a SAWCSM?"

    This is where most of my exposure to social justice movements comes from. As far as I can tell, the term "SAWCSM" was invented by feminist redditors, and routinely and systematically use it as an insult.
    Wow, that must've been a pretty horrible experience. You okay?
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  18. Post #1458
    gay mexican
    Lankist's Avatar
    July 2006
    14,576 Posts
    Holy hell what, I don't even... what, oh god haha. I have no idea what you're trying to imply or how you jumped to that conclusion.
    You said treat everyone as though they're all the same, and I inferred that you have some means of enforcing that.

    Men and women are different. The solution to sexism is not to treat women like they are men.
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  19. Post #1459
    I survived the Temple of Doom
    NoShogun's Avatar
    December 2008
    6,101 Posts
    You said "it's an opinion" as though that gives it license.

    News flash: your opinion is wrong.
    Semantics: the study of meaning of words or sentences.

    I said one guy had an opinion (which was valid) and you argue that when I said that I actually meant was that all opinions are valid. SATISFIED?
    Also, care to tell me why my opinion is wrong or would you rather just sit there and tell me that it is, like you've been doing?
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  20. Post #1460
    gay mexican
    Lankist's Avatar
    July 2006
    14,576 Posts
    What games are women spending more money on?
    Social and casual games, which are now the most profitable sector in the industry. These games make more money than the Big-Three combined.

    Women own this industry now from the consumer standpoint, and yet all of the development costs are going toward games engineered specifically for men at the expense of women, and the "gaming culture" remains rife with misogyny.
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  21. Post #1461
    Hello, my name is Penis. Please refer to me as such. I'm totally cool with it.
    SPESSMEHREN's Avatar
    November 2009
    4,612 Posts
    wow somebody called you a SAWCSM you must know what it's like to be persecuted then.
    I'm not straight, so no, I'm not a SAWCSM. Funny you'd jump to conclusions like that and try to erase my sexual identity. And I know what it's like to be persecuted, thank you very much. I see you're familiar with the term though, perhaps this explains something.

    I just find it sad that they feel the need to invent words and acronyms to insult people....... something you said they don't do.
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  22. Post #1462
    Gold Member
    trotskygrad's Avatar
    June 2011
    8,488 Posts
    Social and casual games, which are now the most profitable sector in the industry. These games make more money than the Big-Three combined.

    Women own this industry now from the consumer standpoint, and yet all of the development costs are going toward games engineered specifically for men at the expense of women, and the "gaming culture" remains rife with misogyny.
    afaik social and casual games are designed by companies like zynga which are totally independent from dev houses like EA.

    Plus is farmville really sexist? lole.

    In fact, I'd argue shit like imvu is more catered towards girls than men because I felt lost and disinterested while playing it, simply because most clothing options I would never wear IRL.
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  23. Post #1463
    Gold Member
    Dennab
    February 2007
    13,126 Posts
    Oh good, white straight males need more help.
    Why the fuck not? I want equal treatment, without any deviations. No over-representation of one gender, no special treatment, no discrimination is any less severe than the other. White males deserve equally good or equally bad treatment, because everyone no matter their skin color, gender or sexuality should be proud or ashamed of something they were born with. Things you can not control should not be held against you.
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  24. Post #1464
    gay mexican
    Lankist's Avatar
    July 2006
    14,576 Posts
    I see you're familiar with the term though, perhaps this explains something.
    Haha yeah I'm persecuting men alright I didn't just copy and paste the acronym from your post into my post, I knew all about it because I call people that erry day because fuck men.

    Edited:

    Why the fuck not?
    Because white, straight men own everything in the western hemisphere. To deny it is fucking ludicrous.
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  25. Post #1465
    Gold Member
    Patriarch's Avatar
    June 2010
    1,507 Posts
    Why the fuck not? I want equal treatment, without any deviations. No over-representation of one gender, no special treatment, no discrimination is any less severe than the other. White males deserve equally good or equally bad treatment, because everyone no matter their skin color, gender or sexuality should be proud or ashamed of something they were born with. Things you can not control should not be held against you.
    I get what you're saying, but that is perhaps the worst wording you could have ever used in this situation.
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  26. Post #1466
    Gold Member
    sp00ks's Avatar
    January 2008
    12,039 Posts
    Why the fuck not? I want equal treatment, without any deviations. No over-representation of one gender, no special treatment, no discrimination is any less severe than the other. White males deserve equally good or equally bad treatment, because everyone no matter their skin color, gender or sexuality should be proud or ashamed of something they were born with. Things you can not control should not be held against you.
    but women and people of colour are oppressed all over the world. affirmative action is basically a way to undo the effects of this oppression.
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  27. Post #1467
    gay mexican
    Lankist's Avatar
    July 2006
    14,576 Posts
    afaik social and casual games are designed by companies like zynga which are totally independent from dev houses like EA.

    Plus is farmville really sexist? lole.
    Uhh we're talking about the games industry. EA =/= the games industry.
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  28. Post #1468
    Gold Member
    Dennab
    February 2007
    13,126 Posts
    The solution to sexism is not to treat women like they are men.
    Would it be better to treat men like women?
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  29. Post #1469
    Gold Member
    Patriarch's Avatar
    June 2010
    1,507 Posts
    Would it be better to treat men like women?
    It would be better to treat them as human beings; gender is a social construct which really limits us all, and whilst women do suffer the most from it, men are also put into a situation with higher responsibility.
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  30. Post #1470
    gay mexican
    Lankist's Avatar
    July 2006
    14,576 Posts
    Would it be better to treat men like women?
    See, you aren't fucking getting it.

    Sexism stems from treating people like something they aren't.

    Your little "solution" hinges on everyone meeting your standards.

    You should feel guilty if you're fucking incapable of treating people as individuals and embracing their differences.
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  31. Post #1471
    Gold Member
    carcarcargo's Avatar
    October 2007
    14,786 Posts
    but women and people of colour are oppressed all over the world. affirmative action is basically a way to undo the effects of this oppression.
    People of colour are oppressed in western countries not "across the world", I'd hardly imagine asians are persecuted in their own countries.
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  32. Post #1472
    Gold Member
    trotskygrad's Avatar
    June 2011
    8,488 Posts
    Uhh we're talking about the games industry. EA =/= the games industry.
    yeah and I'm saying that the industry's sector for making casual and social games is separate from that making action games.
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  33. Post #1473
    gay mexican
    Lankist's Avatar
    July 2006
    14,576 Posts
    It would be better to treat them as human beings; gender is a social construct which really limits us all, and whilst women do suffer the most from it, men are also put into a situation with higher responsibility.
    Gender isn't a social construct. What the fuck?

    It's a biological construct.

    The key to gender equality is not to pretend gender doesn't exist.
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  34. Post #1474
    Gold Member
    Dennab
    February 2007
    13,126 Posts
    Because white, straight men own everything in the western hemisphere. To deny it is fucking ludicrous.
    So fucking what? Did everyone who's born as a white straight man choose for straight white men to own everything in the western hemisphere? No. You do not choose, shit happens.
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  35. Post #1475
    Gold Member
    trotskygrad's Avatar
    June 2011
    8,488 Posts
    People of colour are oppressed in western countries not "across the world", I'd hardly imagine asians are persecuted in their own countries.
    civil wars and stuff man.

    People will find ways to divide themselves despite how much they share in common. Look at the balkans.

    But yeah that's beside the point.
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  36. Post #1476
    Gold Member
    carcarcargo's Avatar
    October 2007
    14,786 Posts
    civil wars and stuff man.

    People will find ways to divide themselves despite how much they share in common. Look at the balkans.

    But yeah that's beside the point.
    civil wars arent really races fighting each other though
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  37. Post #1477
    I survived the Temple of Doom
    NoShogun's Avatar
    December 2008
    6,101 Posts
    Social and casual games, which are now the most profitable sector in the industry. These games make more money than the Big-Three combined.

    Women own this industry now from the consumer standpoint, and yet all of the development costs are going toward games engineered specifically for men at the expense of women, and the "gaming culture" remains rife with misogyny.
    The reason that these social/casual games are making so much money and selling so much is because they're cheap and easy to make and they're fun and practical. Even people who don't like videogames will be willing to spend a few bucks on Angry Birds or something on their iPhone that they can mess around with on the bus if they get bored. Noone but a fairly regular gamer is going to drop $60 on a title. More money goes into the games that appeal to men not because of sexism but because the male gaming community values high-production value blockbuster setpiece photorealistic graphics high bloom games for the most part and those are expensive to produce. Social networking games or fun little distractions like Farmville or Angry Birds are not.
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  38. Post #1478
    Gold Member
    trotskygrad's Avatar
    June 2011
    8,488 Posts
    civil wars arent really races fighting each other though
    yeah, that's why it was beside the point. I was just disagreeing with "I'd hardly imagine asians are persecuted in their own countries."
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  39. Post #1479
    Gold Member
    Patriarch's Avatar
    June 2010
    1,507 Posts
    Gender isn't a social construct. What the fuck?

    It's a biological construct.

    The key to gender equality is not to pretend gender doesn't exist.
    Well obviously biology is heavily involved, but society also has norms and ideals which affect it.
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  40. Post #1480
    Gold Member
    Im Crimson's Avatar
    December 2005
    6,046 Posts
    Uhh we're talking about the games industry. EA =/= the games industry.
    He means companies LIKE EA. And the Social/Casual game genre certainly doesn't equal the entire gaming industry either, even if they are making a significant profit. No social/casual games appeared as examples in the trailer for the kickstarter, because you can bet your ass you won't find the same levels of misogynism in games like Farmville as in other genres.
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