1. Post #81
    8)

    October 2012
    7 Posts
    Oh yeah, and they say("unveal") this after 70 years.

    FAKE
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  2. Post #82
    Gold Member
    Thom12255's Avatar
    January 2009
    8,475 Posts
    It was inevitable, with or without Hitler.

    Treaty of Versailles.
    The Treaty didn't do shit to cause a war.
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  3. Post #83
    Gold Member
    Dennab
    January 2005
    4,680 Posts
    Fuck, who wouldn't break down completely in a situation like that?



    Yeah, fuck showing empathy for other people that we all hate.

    I'm sure if Hitler was here, he'd agree with you.
    see the problem with this comparison is that you're comparing a genocidal war criminal with a bunch of civilians
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  4. Post #84
    so he WAS bullied into suicide
    how many likes does his page have huh???
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  5. Post #85

    September 2012
    848 Posts
    uhhhmmm

    how
    By lacking empathy, you are being the opposite of altruistic, egoistic.

  6. Post #86
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  7. Post #87
    Gold Member
    Dennab
    January 2005
    4,680 Posts
    By lacking empathy, you are being the opposite of altruistic, egoistic.
    okay

    1) I have empathy, just not for someone like hitler
    2) those two aren't opposites
    2a) even if they were, self-interest has nothing to do with it
    2b) lack of qualification of a single criterion of a larger idea does not automatically make one the opposite of that idea
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  8. Post #88

    September 2012
    848 Posts
    okay

    1) I have empathy, just not for someone like hitler
    2) those two aren't opposites
    2a) even if they were, self-interest has nothing to do with it
    2b) lack of qualification of a single criterion of a larger idea does not automatically make one the opposite of that idea
    1) Hitler had no empathy for the people he killed
    2) Yes they are, antonyms.
    2a) Self-interest in the sense that you don't care for others, i.e. self interest.
    2b) It does when the idea is implied to mean the metaphorical adherence to all criterion, such as empathy. You cannot be empathic towards one person and not another, to do so is to not be empathic.
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  9. Post #89
    Gold Member
    DarkWolf2's Avatar
    July 2007
    6,432 Posts
    That's because he was dead. You don't seem to know anything about Rommel other than some vague history points.
    My point being is that he never commited any war crimes that should warrant a trial. He refused to kill jewish PoW's or kill captured enemy commando's, both in direct violation of Hitler's orders. In my opinion, he was more of a loyal German fighting for his fatherland than agreeing with the atrocities that Hitler committed (and even fighting against them).

    And no, I did not read or see all there is about Rommel. Is that any reason why that should warrant a lashing out like that from you?

  10. Post #90
    Gold Member
    Thom12255's Avatar
    January 2009
    8,475 Posts
    Except - you know - Britain and France stopped enforcing the treaty in the 1930's, the Treaty had been getting more lenient towards Germany in the 1920's as public opinion sympathised with how harsh it was. Germany's prime goal in the 1920's was to get the allies to change the treaty and they were doing a good job at it, no one in their right mind in the Weimar government wanted to go to war over it though.

    The treaty was a propaganda tool for the right-wing from the moment it was signed but that is all it was. The reason for WW2 was Hitler's ambitions in the east. And Hitler was only in that position because of the collapse of the Republic due to the Wall Street Crash in 1929 which had nothing to do with the Treaty of Versailles.

    The terms of the treaty themselves weren't even all that bad compared to what Germany was intending to do to Russia in Brest-Litovsk. Germany was the defeated party, they were going to be punished. And actually, they weren't punished greatly. Most of the territory they lost was because of self-determination for people's such as the Poles who wanted their own country(Which was a big deal in Wilsons 14-points so Germany shouldn't have been surprised). The cutting of the military was understandable due to how Germany had just spent the last 20 years sabre rattling in Europe and it's not like this put Germany in any danger, they were in no position for another war with their current military state so cutting it down helped them more than anything in allowing them to spend their budget somewhere else. The reparations, while insanely high, were reduced in the 20's and most likely would have continued to be as relations normalized between the nations. The reparations never hurt Germany in any seeable way. Hyperinflation in 1923 was due to Germany's idea that it didn't have to pay the French the reparations and infact the Government had been following a policy of high inflation and borrowing since the start of the war and they continued to do so after the peace settlement so they could make it look to the allies that they would not be able to pay the reparations while at the same time keep people in Germany think the economy was doing well.

    So what did the Treaty actually do to Germany that caused a World War?
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  11. Post #91
    Gold Member
    Dennab
    January 2005
    4,680 Posts
    2b) It does when the idea is implied to mean the metaphorical adherence to all criterion, such as empathy. You cannot be empathic towards one person and not another, to do so is to not be empathic.
    you're KIDDING right
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  12. Post #92
    Gold Member
    Sgt Doom's Avatar
    March 2005
    20,111 Posts
    It's quite amusing how we get compassionate comments in a thread about Adolf Hitler, but in any thread relating to gypsies, other minorities, criminals, Justin Bieber etc.; suddenly the pool of compassion dries up faster than a woman's vagina upon seeing a brony convention.
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  13. Post #93
    It's really sad because if you forget the whole "holocaust" thing Hitler was just like any other person.
    The way people demonize Hitler is just absurd
    Fuck this section I'm out
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  14. Post #94
    I make sexist and racist jokes all the time yet,i still support the feminist movement and the rights of blacks.
    znk666's Avatar
    July 2010
    5,535 Posts
    You guys legitimately feel sorry for a mental breakdown of a war criminal responsible for the deaths of millions based on their ethnicity?
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  15. Post #95

    August 2011
    707 Posts
    England and Germany were bros really.
    Sarcasm or you're joking?
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  16. Post #96
    Gold Member
    doommarine23's Avatar
    December 2005
    7,712 Posts
    You guys legitimately feel sorry for a mental breakdown of a war criminal responsible for the deaths of millions based on their ethnicity?
    As much as I try to feel sorry for any other human-being, not easy but I and I'm sure many others do try.

    Can't just put values and limits on who and what deserves empathy or sympathy or human compassion. I guess it really comes back to your personality, I try to love everyone, others aren't as caring and that's totally understandable.

    Of course, you can also use the argument that by seeing them as sub-human you're kind of being like them in the sense of judging others and no-longer valuing their lives simply because of things they have done or you perceive. Which to be fair none of us are mini-Hitlers, but I rather not share an apathy for human-life.
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  17. Post #97
    Dennab
    September 2011
    3,417 Posts
    *shrug*

    I don't care

    it's hitler after all
    ~so edgy & cool~
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  18. Post #98
    WhatAmI's Avatar
    June 2012
    1,563 Posts
    No fucks given
    I hope he suffered immensely before that pussy fuck offed himself
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  19. Post #99
    Gold Member
    jeimizu's Avatar
    August 2007
    6,421 Posts
    kind of odd, but he sent Hess to negotiate peace terms with the UK in 1941, although he got captured
    I thought Hess did that on his own, against Hitler's wishes.

    Wikipedia posted:
    Hitler granted Hess' wife a pension but stripped Hess of all of his party and state offices, and privately ordered him shot on sight if he ever returned to Germany.
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  20. Post #100
    Gold Member
    Chrille's Avatar
    August 2005
    5,427 Posts
    He was still a human being yo, I'm not saying this doesn't make him a horrible fucking killer. I'm just saying it's sad to see a human being waist away into nothingness, any human.
    No, it's not sad. He orchestrated the deaths of millions people, and indirectly caused the death's of many, many more millions. If you say shit like this it's like you literally do not understand what he did. He deserved everything that he got, and even got off easy. Incredibly easy.
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  21. Post #101
    Gold Member
    JustExtreme's Avatar
    April 2007
    7,104 Posts
    So he was a cowardly, somewhat mental, twisted, insecure, illogical idiot with a penchant for speaking but not so much strategy.

    That honestly speaks wonders. Hitler was just an idiot.
    Indeed, I wouldn't be surprised if many of his actions were just part of a superiority complex to compensate for an inferiority complex developed due to his true idiocy.

    I'll bet he had, in CBT terms, several Early Maladaptive Schemas.

    A lot of politicians even today seem to view themselves as superior to others.

  22. Post #102
    I WOTCH ANIEM
    Maximo13's Avatar
    October 2008
    8,053 Posts
    I think I remember hearing somewhere that the "killing Jews" thing was more ordered by Himmler or somesuch. I'm probably wrong, though.
    Himmler said that Goebbels had an irrational hatred towards jewish people, and Goebbels and Hitler would have hour long late night conversations.

  23. Post #103
    dubstep
    SCopE5000's Avatar
    August 2005
    4,193 Posts
    Whilst I disagree with Nazism and Hitler's Regime, I think a fair, single-party dictatorship would probably be the best way to run the world these days.

    All wars ended.

    Entire military budget for every country (trillions) redistributed into balancing the worlds impoverished areas, funding growth and development in order to sustain the entire populace, and then put into research, science, space exploration, etc.

    Political ideology formed which is allows for corporation and competition to thrive, much is poured into entrepreneurs and budgets are allocated for new employers and competitors which drives technology forward on multiple levels, from agriculture all the way up to high-tech industry.

    Nation-states granted control over their individual areas to best develop and improve them, as they are essentially only diplomats, no unfair distribution of governmental wealth can form (ie owner of country buys thousands of cars whilst people suffer).

    Oil and food prices equalised, and the monopolistic nature of acquiring these products is reduced via government share purchasing/ company takeover.

    Jobseekers allowance (the dole) is removed, and replaced with a token system, and seeing as jobs are now rife, contribution to society is recommended and encouraged. Re-education and education at up to university level is now open to anyone over 25, free of charge, provided they can show a high level of interest in the target subject, a genuine interest to learn and improve, and some suitable skills in a similar field (self taught included).

    Well-equipped universal police force formed, focus on eradicating terrorism, cell and cult behaviours from arising. Racism, hate crime, belief/religiously-motivated crimes are treated with priority - punishment is replaced with rehabilitation with a focus on breaking down these shitty beliefs and replacing it with a knowledge of self and the formation of beliefs. It would be very easy to derive a test for if people 'got it'. I truly believe that if you entirely demolish someone's belief system they can come from any walk of life, be it the most dogmatic, unfortunate and aggressive circumstances - and leave as well-informed and contributing members of society.

    People have the choice of giving their kids up when they're born and enrol them in a facility, for 16 years, at no cost, which allows for absolutely equal treatment regardless of race/ skin colour, no chance of bullying forming, an incredibly high level of education, and exposure to all forms of art, music, expression, and a knowledge of beliefs similar to the one granted to the people in rehab.

    Kids in this facility would choose everything for themselves, including their own names, from the moment they are well versed in linguistics - as well as the subject areas they specialize in.

    After this stage, graduating students from the facility would be granted specialist roles in society of their choice.

    Racist families, religious fundamentalists/ extremists, violent or abusive people and other terribly negative or damning people would be offered a straightener programme, designed to get their lives back on track in the most efficient way, staying in a treatment/relaxation facility designed specifically for this purpose, with utmost care and comfort.

    Failure to attend the program, and continued aggressive behavior would most likely lead to imprisonment and rehabilitation. Damage to society and other people would be mitigated, with people directly affected by a persons negative behavior offered treatment, rehabilitation and relaxation at a facility for as long as they require.

    People with mental issues would also be offered a programme designed to help them get their lives back on track in the most efficient way, also staying in a treatment/relaxation facility designed for this purpose, with utmost care and comfort.

    Whilst religion would still be 'permitted' - it would be seen for what it is, a set of beliefs established to help people live their lives, nothing more. 'Truth' found in religion would be linked to a greater understanding of nature present in all religions - not the 'Faux Truths' - such as taking The Bible literally and word-for-word (which is contradictory, I can explain further if necessary).

    With the world government formed, quality of life for everyone would be improved, technology would fly forward at an unprecedented rate, and soon enough, space exploration would be the next step for humanity.
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  24. Post #104
    hi there
    Dennab
    September 2011
    5,898 Posts
    Snip distasteful joke nevermind

  25. Post #105
    WhatAmI's Avatar
    June 2012
    1,563 Posts
    this thread is unbelievable

    facepunch: nazi dictatorship of neckbeards since 2006
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  26. Post #106
    Gold Member
    Thom12255's Avatar
    January 2009
    8,475 Posts
    this thread is unbelievable

    facepunch: nazi dictatorship of neckbeards since 2006
    I'm more concerned with the apparent ignorance towards basic pre-WW2 history.
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  27. Post #107
    Gold Member
    Hellborg 65's Avatar
    March 2006
    3,256 Posts
    No it wasn't.

    The German economy had recovered and the Extremist Communist and Nazi parties were suffering from a loss of support until the great depression came along.
    Yeah, and the Great Depression caused the Nazis to get support leading to WW2.

    But what caused the Great Depression to hurt Germany even more? The Treaty of Versailles.
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  28. Post #108
    Cathedral's Avatar
    August 2012
    262 Posts
    I'm surprised that this thread isn't full to the brim with the usual posts retroactively attempting to paint(heh) Hitler as some sort of tactical genius and artist extraordinaire.

  29. Post #109
    You're Gonna Carry That Weight.
    jaykray's Avatar
    June 2008
    7,184 Posts
    I'm surprised that this thread isn't full to the brim with the usual posts retroactively attempting to paint(heh) Hitler as some sort of tactical genius and artist extraordinaire.
    Nope, instead it's full of people trying to paint him (heh) as some sort of tortured misunderstood soul who deserves our sympathy because he got a bit upset before he killed himself.
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  30. Post #110
    Cathedral's Avatar
    August 2012
    262 Posts
    Nope, instead it's full of people trying to paint him (heh) as some sort of tortured misunderstood soul who deserves our sympathy because he got a bit upset before he killed himself.
    Baby steps.

  31. Post #111
    Gold Member
    Thom12255's Avatar
    January 2009
    8,475 Posts
    Yeah, and the Great Depression caused the Nazis to get support leading to WW2.

    But what caused the Great Depression to hurt Germany even more? The Treaty of Versailles.
    What hurt Germany in the Depression was that all the countries that had been providing economic assistance suddenly stopped and even asked for Germany to immediately re-pay the loans they had given it. These loans were not given to Germany because of ToV, Germany's economy was terrible because they never paid for anything in the First World War as they were sure they would have won. They borrowed money and inflated their economy. After the war, much of their export markets were no longer open and so had an even harder time. But even through all this, in the mid-20's their economy had recovered to 1913 levels and was continuing to improve with American backed loans.

    The Treaty of Versailles did not cause WW2, saying it does is hugely over-simplifying everything that happened from the end of the war till 1933. If you want a basic reason for why Hitler took over Germany it is that the left-wing parties didn't form a coalition against him as the communists hated the moderate SPD due to being backstabbed in 1919. If they had formed a coalition then the Nazi's would not have gained power.

    You really shouldn't sympathise with Germany over the Treaty of Versailles, be sure, if Germany had won, they would given us extremely harsh terms due to how they handled their economy during the war, also shown in how they treated the Russians in 1917.
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  32. Post #112
    dubstep
    SCopE5000's Avatar
    August 2005
    4,193 Posts
    this thread is unbelievable

    facepunch: nazi dictatorship of neckbeards since 2006
    http://www.facepunch.com/showthread....1#post38206050

    Why dumb?

    I don't care about the rating, I just want to hear an actual answer/ opinion/ argument from you on my ideology, so I can better understand why someone would not want it.
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  33. Post #113
    I am a moderator.
    Swebonny's Avatar
    August 2006
    13,020 Posts
    Nope, instead it's full of people trying to paint him (heh) as some sort of tortured misunderstood soul who deserves our sympathy because he got a bit upset before he killed himself.
    But he was. Just like Assad, Qaddafi and all the dictators in the world. Innocent misguided souls that should absolutely not be held responsible for anything they've done. They were all betrayed *cry*
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  34. Post #114
    Gold Member
    Thom12255's Avatar
    January 2009
    8,475 Posts
    I feel sorry for the child that Hitler once was, he had a shit childhood and it messed him up for life but what he did later on in life was his choice and he did some fucked up shit.

  35. Post #115
    You're Gonna Carry That Weight.
    jaykray's Avatar
    June 2008
    7,184 Posts
    But he was. Just like Assad, Qaddafi and all the dictators in the world. Innocent misguided souls that should absolutely not be held responsible for anything they've done. They were all betrayed *cry*
    QQaddafi, AssSAD, SADdam, Osama Bin Ladenwithdeepandterriblethoughts ;_;
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  36. Post #116
    http://www.facepunch.com/showthread....1#post38206050

    Why dumb?

    I don't care about the rating, I just want to hear an actual answer/ opinion/ argument from you on my ideology, so I can better understand why someone would not want it.
    because it is hopelessly utopian and simply wouldn't work in practice
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  37. Post #117
    Stethor's Avatar
    April 2010
    67 Posts
    This reminds me of the Onions article on Hitlers depression where everyone suddenly feels sorry for him as he commited suicide
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  38. Post #118
    Gold Member
    Dennab
    June 2005
    15,081 Posts
    Anyone who thinks the Treaty of Versailles was directly responsible for WW2 really didn't study this beyond school.
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  39. Post #119
    So apparently the majority of Facepunch seem to think its okay to feel sorry for Hitler, regardless of the fact that he brought death to millions of people.

    okay.
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  40. Post #120
    Gold Member
    Dennab
    June 2005
    15,081 Posts
    You're either fucking weird or fucking stupid.

    I haven't decided yet.
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