But my point is that we cannot even estimate whether aliens are out there or not with our current knowledge of the emerging of life.
But my point is that we cannot even estimate whether aliens are out there or not with our current knowledge of the emerging of life.
Nobody can tell whether we have been visited or not.
There are Hundreds of Billions of individual solar systems in a galaxy (each of which perfectly capable of churning out live-habitable planets) or more, there may be trillions upon trillions of galaxies in the universe, judging from the fact that there is more beyond than what we can currently observe. It is difficult to think that were alone once you do the math. Take it this way: Imagine a desert planet the size of earth, the entire surface covered in sand dunes, imagine that 99.995% of the planets individual grains of sand is just your typical tan'ish color; the inhabitable planets, now imagine that the remaining 0.005% of the sand grains are blue, these are the planets harboring life, do the math and that's a lot of planets with life. But lets take it a step further, imagine that 0.995% of those blue grains of sand only contain mediocre life such as bacteria, the remaining 0.005% of the rest of the blue grainlettes contain life that manages to evolve and prosper, perhaps into walking/thinking civilizations. That's a lot of zeroes followed by a 5, the end result though would STILL end up with a massive number of thinking sentient civilizations.
The universe is massive, we'd have to do a lot of searching before we can find any other planet that we are certain can contain life. It's definitely out there. There may be beings who have had a head-start of millions or even billions of years to make their technology. Imagining humanity 5 years from now is difficult, a million years or more would be impossible for anyone to contemplate.
I have to agree with "Rad McCool" to some extent here. Has anyone read the wikipedia article on drake's equation?
It says the current estimates on the terms in drakes equation only suggest there to be 2.31 intelligent civilizations in our galaxy (including us) that are trying to communicate. And remember, these are just estimates. It's entirely possible that, from a pessimistic estimation, you could have only 0.000065 communicative civilizations. Or, from a optimistic perspective, 20,000.
All I, and I believe Rad, are trying to say, is that given our current data, we can't really draw much of a conclusion at all.
In addition, assuming the current expected value of communicative civilizations, 2.31, is correct, that's still only an expected value of 1.31 other communicative civilizations in our galaxy. I'm not sure about the probability distribution here, but I don't think there being an actual value of zero other communicative civilizations is that unlikely.
I find it impossible for extraterrestrial intelligent life to NOT exist! There are billions of star system in just a few galaxies, and it is quite likely to have at least a few planets in there capable of supporting life. If some planets have evolved to sentient, intelligent life, then there would be at least a few in a few billion. There are many galaxies we know of in our universe, and with the estimated size of the universe, there are far more than we could ever be able to consider. However, the odds of us contacting each other, as we can see, is minimal.
Consider this: Human beings have only existed for a tiny sliver of the history of earth's life forms. Mathematically speaking, if there are life forms out there more advanced than us, they're much more advanced than us. Their technology would be like magic to us. They could pretty much do whatever they wanted. Now, interfering with us may have an array of consequences that they may foresee that we wouldn't.
Also, if aliens come to earth, please don't attack them. They will win. It would be like a gorilla fighting a predator drone.
If intelligent life wants us to notice them, we will; if they don't, we can't.
Extraterrestrial life exists, extraterrestrial life more intelligent than us also exists. You would be very thick to assume we're all alone in the universe, the odds of extraterrestrial life existing is astronomically large. It would be very unlikely that we've been visited by extraterrestrial life on Earth. Earth is just an average planet rotating around an average star. I find it unlikely that an alien species would decide to visit Earth. I find it even more unlikely that they would be seen by humans.
Just skimming over the thread, but it seems that someone brought up the Drake equation. In my opinion it's an incredibly inaccurate measure of extraterrestrial civilizations. Most of the equation is just guessing.
Most likely if an extraterrestrial civilization encountered us their technology would be much much more advanced then ours. If we we're to enter a conflict with them it would be like sponges vs nukes.
It's so astronomically probable that extraterrestrial life exists that it's almost a guarantee.
Probabilities don't dictate fact.
But whether there's an entire another civilization or a society of other intelligent fucks.. well that's just a lot less likely, seeing as how our practical and beautiful and complex bodies are a near miracle, the result of billions of years of evolution.
I think not.
Not until it's proven there are.
I don't believe there is other life in the universe, only when proven otherwise. I know there's a fucking big chance there is life in the universe, but theres chance that there is not.
sure, why not.
I think there is something out there it's just they don't want to come to our shitty place.
I believe there is a LOT of evidence to support E.T. and his trek through the universe, in fact it is enough to have me convinced that we are the creation of extra terrestrials. Think i'm crazy? Maybe... but keep reading first.. I present my evidence as such;
The Epic of Gilgamesh
For any of you who have heard the theories on the "Cradle of Civilization" (wiki) A big player in the idea has been the Mesopotamian Empire, or the Summerians. This civilization is debated as one of the starting points for our modern civilization. Historians today believe the culture arose from farmers and hunter-gatherers who came together and formed a very successful empire. As far as we can tell, they were the first empire to settle permanently and begin practicing extensive year-round agriculture about 5000 B.C. This would put them at the forefront of agriculture for the time.
Interestingly however, is their creation story called the Epic of Gilgamesh (wiki), of which very few tablets remain and is considered one of the earliest known works of man. In it, it details the story of Gilgamesh, the king of Uruk (a Sumer city) and his friendship to a man named Enkidu whom the Gods created to keep Gilgamesh distracted from oppressing the people. It eventually details his quest for immortality and other adventures through the historic world. Most importantly about this Epic is the Epic of Atrahasis (wiki) which essentially is the very first telling of the Flood Story (a'la The Bible and many other works of creation).
And here's the important part for this section... In the Epic of Atrahasis the Gods arrived from the heavens in two form, the Lesser and the Greater. These Gods required materials from our world in order to continue their odyssey through the universe. So for years and years the Lesser Gods toiled away on the land for the Greater Gods, until finally they grew tired of the back-breaking work and revolted. After some conflict the Greater Gods agreed to relieve the burden of the Lesser Gods. It was proposed that man would be created for this. A God with cunning was sacrificed and his "essence" was used to create us. The Gods took care of everything, watching over us and guiding us. Ensuring we were protected and fed, but only so long as they needed us and we continued to mine for them. Eventually, the Gods became satisfied with what they had gathered and one Greater God, Enlil, had decided we as humans were too much of a blight to continue. Claiming us to be "noisy" he planned to rid of us through a flood. The other Gods however, did not appreciate this and so one in particular sent a dream of warning to a human man, Atrahasis. He told him of the coming flood and instructed him to build a boat and to board all who he could; two of each animal, his family, and any one else who would listen. Successfully Atrahasis is able to build a boat and escape the impending doom. Afterwards, Enlil discovered this betrayal of his peers and became infuriated, but not before the other Gods implored him to allow us to continue. Eventually agreeing, he settled on leaving us to live but instead endowed us with the imperfections of being human. Now we were mortal, disease and starvation would affect us, stillbirth, and many other burdens were placed onto man to keep us in check. And then they left.
Today we have a miraculous science called Genetics which has almost certainly opened up Pandora's Box regarding political, social, and biological views of ourselves. One specific point to arise from this science has been the discovery of Mitochondrial-EVE (wiki). Essentially, Eve is our most distant but equally common ancestor. According to genetics we can trace back nearly everyone's genetics to her (on our mother's side). So essentially she is the Eve of the Adam and Eve duo many of us are so familiar with in scripture. This isn't to say that she was the ONLY woman of that time, but that her genetics have become the most successful throughout the centuries up to now. As far as we can tell, she lived in the South African region and is estimated to have lived about 200,000 years ago.
Ancient ruins in Africa (info)
One way to tie Mitochondrial-Eve into all this is the discovery of ruins in South Africa that date way back into our history. People in the area have always seen them there and never knew who or what built them, until recently. Amazingly we have been able to date these ruins by comparing the astronomical calendars (stone monoliths) with the rise and fall of the sun and stars as they would have been in the past, and what they found is a little surprising. As far as we can tell these ruins in South Africa, which span anywhere from 1500 square miles to 10,000 square miles across, date back roughly 160,000 to 200,000 years ago (WOW). These ruins essentially predate any notions we previously had about the dawn of man by tens of thousands of years, if not more. Even more amazing is the fact that these ruins were built by a people who technically should have been very primitive, yet these ruins showcase a civilization with advanced knowledge of Astronomy and mining techniques. As far as we can tell, the civilization placed a heavy emphasis on the mining of Gold.
The mining complexes which dot across the region range anywhere from a few meters to 500 meters beneath the ground and amazingly it seems the ancients were extremely precise in discovering the mineral and removing it from the ground, practices which as far as we can tell, never existed until around the Bronze Age and thereafter.
So... What does this all mean?
Have you ever wondered why so many ancient civilizations reveled in Gold? The Egyptians and Mayans for instance worshiped the mineral. But why would such primitive man need such a mineral? Sure it is pretty, but it is only now in today's world that we understand what a valuable metal it is. Gold does not tarnish over time (like Copper or Iron which rust) and it is also extremely conducive. Primitive man who had no electricity, circuit boards, or electronics should have had no use for it outside of ornamental use. Back then man needed food and shelter, a way to keep his family safe from predators and starvation which inundated the historic world. For a metal which could not be eaten or easily fashioned into shelter or tools for the time, they sure mined a heck of a lot of it in South Africa and where did it all go?
Isn't it curious that Mitochondrial EVE resided just North of these massive ruins, or how a region between the Tigris and Euphrates (right around where the Sumer empire rose to power and existed) has been filled with water for over 60,000 years but was once dry and free of water yet there is no explanation of why the region flooded. Isn't it also fascinating that ruins across the African and Persian regions display unique traits such as precision cutting that would compare to a laser tool (something unknown and out of reach for men living beyond even 150 years ago never the less 60,000-200,000 years ago)?
There is a LOT of evidence for it, i've only given you a few here but its a good start if someone is really interested.
Well all I can really say if extra terrestrials did come to earth they would want to find the most successful form of life which isn't us, they would more come to study bacteria. Which would be very dangerous.
First of all, if there was a possibility that an advanced civilization visited our planet either in the past or recent years, it would be logical to assume they would make sure we had absolutely no chance of detecting them unless they wanted us to. All these eyewitness accounts and stories and what not are a pile of horseshit that would make an advanced extraterrestrial race seem like some sort of retards who can't even pilot their own ships (note that these et life forms would have to have technology so advanced that it would not even be comprehensible to us so their intelligence would vastly outsmart us). Even IF aliens did exist and wanted to communicate with us it would be like us trying to communicate with worms.
Now there are a lot of documentaries and stuff like that about ancient aliens or recent ufo sightings etc., yet there really is no professional field for the study of extraterrestrial life. You think governments wouldn't all jump at the possibility of finding out if aliens actually did visit our planet/ are visiting it? Think about the amount of money that would be invested in this field if any respected scientist would think there's even a small chance that this might be true, yet, of course, there's no real evidence to prove anything. If there was real evidence to prove towards the apparent existence of aliens visiting our planet then trust me when I say every big corporations and governments would invest their full attention into this matter, just how it was with the space race in the 1960s.
Also, there is no doubt among most scientist that there is a lot more life in the universe, and the possibility of other advanced civilizations existing is also highly probable when you take the incomprehensibly high number of planets that could sustain life into account.
Also, with regards to non carbon based life, the chance of it being intelligent is basically zero. The carbon atom is just too fundamental for the complex biological systems that would be able to grant intelligence.
Assuming that life out there will be chemically based on carbon like ourselves (there are other theoretical forms of life) and require sunlight (it doesn't) and vast amounts of water (life like us can't live without it) then we take into account the amount of earth like planets we've found and the amount of planets and moons that have earth like warm oceans then the chances of life being somewhere in our galaxy alone is a near certainty. When you expand that to the billions of galaxies in the virgo super cluster alone then life is at a near certainty to exist and when you get to the scale of the whole universe then there's some form of life out there somewhere.
On the flipside the distances involved are so huge that they evade human comprehension so it's pretty likely that unless Io or Europa harbor life then there's a really good chance we'll never meet those aliens.
Sure thing there are aliens somewhere in the universe. But they have never been to Earth.
If they have been here why have they never once attempted to contact us or interact with us in any meaningful way? What is the reasoning behind this?
Course they haven't been here.
It would be very thick to assume life other than that on our planet exists.
In the 6000 years that this universe has been around, life emerging would be as likley as a 747 assembling on its own.
I mean, just take earth for example. There are currently 1.9 MILLION discovered species know to man. 1.9 Million!
And out of those 1.9 million species only one of them is what we call intelligent. Homo Sapiens, us.
If you look at the chances only on this planet, imagine the minuscule chances of actually meeting another intelligent specie in this vast space of dead planets.
We're not the only intelligent life on earth mate, you must be a bit behind cause there are about 4 or 5 species that we are studying just now that we are considering classing as intelligent. Among them are whales, dolphins and ravens.
I reckon they're real, the universe being as big as it is. I doubt there's any of them here though, unless they'd been travelling for millions of years before they got here which is pretty unlikely.
You may say that these are only temporary limits. Back in the 70s AI researchers thought so too.
We can't go faster than the speed of light either.
Technology isn't magic like most seem to believe. Saying that just because we may improve doesn't mean it's possible. The limits are clear.