1. Post #281
    Gold Member
    xXDictatorXx's Avatar
    December 2007
    1,609 Posts
    Case 1: Women are capable of organising themselves, why do they need men to gather them up? In this case people just need to pull together, help each other and not panic.

    Case 2: Everybody is important to someone. I kind of agree with you about children, but I disagree that some people are worth more than others. You can talk about instincts if you like, but we are capable of disregarding our instincts. Women are not worth more than men.
    I agree, I would be broken if I had to leave so many people I love to die just because they are male. Children are one thing ,but adults irregardless of gender usually have someone who loves them. Women are not worth more than men.

  2. Post #282
    Torjuz's Avatar
    January 2011
    3,807 Posts
    It's become a manner, but in the society we live in, women are still different to a man, in the way they want. A man with someone who loves him compared to a hooker, are both worth the same, even though on class, they might be different.

  3. Post #283
    Gold Member
    Lol-Nade's Avatar
    September 2008
    3,740 Posts
    If I were in a crisis where the people I love most (ie. My hypothetical wife and child), of course I would choose their lives over mine. It's not a matter of whether they're independent or strong enough to take care of themselves, it's simply the fact that I wouldn't be able to live with myself knowing I chose my life over theirs.

    Even if it were someone else's wife and child, I would feel better knowing that I put their lives before mine in a disaster.

  4. Post #284
    Gold Member

    May 2005
    2,268 Posts
    If I were in a crisis where the people I love most (ie. My hypothetical wife and child), of course I would choose their lives over mine. It's not a matter of whether they're independent or strong enough to take care of themselves, it's simply the fact that I wouldn't be able to live with myself knowing I chose my life over theirs.

    Even if it were someone else's wife and child, I would feel better knowing that I put their lives before mine in a disaster.
    The first part I can understand, though I don't get the second part. How would you be able to feel better? You would be dead. What logical reason is there to want to die for the sake of someone else.

    Your hypothetical wife and child would have you missing from their lives all because you though it was appropriate to die for someone else's wife and child (also, why not someone's husband?)

  5. Post #285
    Gold Member
    Lol-Nade's Avatar
    September 2008
    3,740 Posts
    The first part I can understand, though I don't get the second part. How would you be able to feel better? You would be dead. What logical reason is there to want to die for the sake of someone else.

    Your hypothetical wife and child would have you missing from their lives all because you though it was appropriate to die for someone else's wife and child (also, why not someone's husband?)
    Of course I would try my best to save a man, it's just the topic is about women and children.

    I guess my logic may seem weird, but I believe in life after death. I would definitely feel better knowing I used my life to save someone else. I'm not denying that my wife and children would feel sad, but I would forever be known as a hero both to them, as well as the family of the person I've saved.

  6. Post #286
    Gold Member
    carcarcargo's Avatar
    October 2007
    15,061 Posts
    The first part I can understand, though I don't get the second part. How would you be able to feel better? You would be dead. What logical reason is there to want to die for the sake of someone else.

    Your hypothetical wife and child would have you missing from their lives all because you though it was appropriate to die for someone else's wife and child (also, why not someone's husband?)
    Well considering you'd saving two people surely that would be better than selfishly saving yourself. As for whether it be husband or wife, I think that's up to that family to decide.

  7. Post #287
    MKH90's Avatar
    February 2009
    224 Posts
    In a life-or-death situation, anyone comparing this rule to basic niceness/chivalry is being a massive dumbass. I GUARANTEE people will not go 'oh, these unknown females/children get to go before me, and it's okay, since it's just like offering a coat to a lady who's shivering'. In the latter, you will be inconvenienced slightly by cold. In the former, you DIE. Survival instincts and all that. With this, I do not mean that willingly sacrificing yourself in itself is dumb, but that kind of comparison makes me cringe.

    Personally, unless there's anyone on board whom I personally know, I'd try to get on a lifeboat ASAP without trying to figure what groups of people have or haven't been saved. I am fully aware that some see this as highly egotistical, or in layman's terms, "the asshole way". Yes, it is exactly that; I value my life more than anyone else's. I do not care whether people agree with me about this (which they will not), I want to live.

    Before someone tries to state the obvious; These examples are made up with the presumption that there are not enough lifeboats/enough time to fill them.

  8. Post #288
    Ask me about my .gif fetish
    st0rmforce's Avatar
    February 2008
    3,594 Posts
    In a life-or-death situation, anyone comparing this rule to basic niceness/chivalry is being a massive dumbass. I GUARANTEE people will not go 'oh, these unknown females/children get to go before me, and it's okay, since it's just like offering a coat to a lady who's shivering'. In the latter, you will be inconvenienced slightly by cold. In the former, you DIE. Survival instincts and all that. With this, I do not mean that willingly sacrificing yourself in itself is dumb, but that kind of comparison makes me cringe.

    Personally, unless there's anyone on board whom I personally know, I'd try to get on a lifeboat ASAP without trying to figure what groups of people have or haven't been saved. I am fully aware that some see this as highly egotistical, or in layman's terms, "the asshole way". Yes, it is exactly that; I value my life more than anyone else's. I do not care whether people agree with me about this (which they will not), I want to live.

    Before someone tries to state the obvious; These examples are made up with the presumption that there are not enough lifeboats/enough time to fill them.
    The sooner you get in the lifeboat, the sooner you are out of the way of anybody else wanting to get in. So long as you aren't pushing people out of the way or starting fights (making the evacuation slower) I think it's the best attitude. If everybody thought like you, the evacuation would by pretty quick because there would be less confusion and more purpose.

  9. Post #289
    Gold Member

    May 2005
    2,268 Posts
    Well considering you'd saving two people surely that would be better than selfishly saving yourself. As for whether it be husband or wife, I think that's up to that family to decide.
    What is the standard by which my sacrifice would be "better"? It's certainly not "better" for my own well-being, or for my own family's emotional well being. And what I mean by the husband or wife thing was that he said he would put his life on the line for someone else's wife and child, so I was saying, why not someone else's husband and child, assuming the wife is out of the picture somewhere?

  10. Post #290
    Gold Member
    Lol-Nade's Avatar
    September 2008
    3,740 Posts
    What is the standard by which my sacrifice would be "better"? It's certainly not "better" for my own well-being, or for my own family's emotional well being. And what I mean by the husband or wife thing was that he said he would put his life on the line for someone else's wife and child, so I was saying, why not someone else's husband and child, assuming the wife is out of the picture somewhere?
    Which I did explain.

  11. Post #291
    Gold Member
    carcarcargo's Avatar
    October 2007
    15,061 Posts
    What is the standard by which my sacrifice would be "better"? It's certainly not "better" for my own well-being, or for my own family's emotional well being. And what I mean by the husband or wife thing was that he said he would put his life on the line for someone else's wife and child, so I was saying, why not someone else's husband and child, assuming the wife is out of the picture somewhere?
    Yeah but you'd be saving two people rather than yourself and your family being happier, surely two lives are far more valuable than one?

  12. Post #292
    Impact1986's Avatar
    December 2011
    1,337 Posts
    Yeah but you'd be saving two people rather than yourself and your family being happier, surely two lives are far more valuable than one?
    Humans aren't exactly going extinct, so why is saving a few more important than saving one self?

  13. Post #293
    Gold Member
    carcarcargo's Avatar
    October 2007
    15,061 Posts
    Humans aren't exactly going extinct, so why is saving a few more important than saving one self?
    Because morally two people dying is generally worse than one person dying.

  14. Post #294
    Gold Member
    Upgrade123's Avatar
    January 2008
    5,478 Posts
    If I were in a crisis where the people I love most (ie. My hypothetical wife and child), of course I would choose their lives over mine. It's not a matter of whether they're independent or strong enough to take care of themselves, it's simply the fact that I wouldn't be able to live with myself knowing I chose my life over theirs.

    Even if it were someone else's wife and child, I would feel better knowing that I put their lives before mine in a disaster.
    And if your wife resisted and used the exact same logic you're using?

  15. Post #295
    JUOPPO's Avatar
    January 2012
    308 Posts
    And if your wife resisted and used the exact same logic you're using?
    Then they both would die.

  16. Post #296
    Gold Member
    Lol-Nade's Avatar
    September 2008
    3,740 Posts
    And if your wife resisted and used the exact same logic you're using?
    Just because someone's life is of equal value to mine, doesn't mean I wouldn't rather they have a better chance of living than I do.

  17. Post #297
    Gold Member
    VenomousBeetle's Avatar
    January 2010
    6,216 Posts
    Never agreed with this. You can call bias on me if you want, but I really disagree with this policy.

    This also brings back to the point that women say equal but there's usually higher rather than equal.

  18. Post #298
    Gold Member
    Upgrade123's Avatar
    January 2008
    5,478 Posts
    Just because someone's life is of equal value to mine, doesn't mean I wouldn't rather they have a better chance of living than I do.
    But it's not like you can force her to leave without you if she's adamant in staying.

  19. Post #299
    Gold Member
    Lol-Nade's Avatar
    September 2008
    3,740 Posts
    But it's not like you can force her to leave without you if she's adamant in staying.
    Why would she stay? There would be no reason for her to stay except to meet her demise.

    Unless you're saying she'd stay behind to help others, which I could understand. But I would make sure that she would be the second last to leave, if she's so insisting.

  20. Post #300
    Gold Member
    Upgrade123's Avatar
    January 2008
    5,478 Posts
    Why would she stay? There would be no reason for her to stay except to meet her demise.

    Unless you're saying she'd stay behind to help others, which I could understand. But I would make sure that she would be the second last to leave, if she's so insisting.
    Why would you stay? There would be no reason for you to stay except to meet your demise.

  21. Post #301
    Purplevain's Avatar
    November 2009
    665 Posts
    I think parents and children first would be much better.